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Post by Swimmy on May 13, 2009 7:26:55 GMT -5
New Yorkers Need Spending Cuts, Not ChecksIt must be a blue moon out! I actually agree with this editorial. Maybe the editorial staff should put a petition together on its own and link to it... Eh, wishful thinking. But still, the points are valid and I couldn't agree more with those points.
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Post by dgriffin on May 13, 2009 16:27:56 GMT -5
Where's Swampfox? There's that "begs the question" misuse again! Clarence?
Anyway .... while I agree in principle with the editorial, we're too far down the road for any meaningful change. Albany or any other government is not going to get fixed any time soon. Cutting spending means cutting jobs. That won't happen while the state is teetering on bankruptcy. Can you imagine what would happen to 10,000 or so out-of work state workers in Albany? Or more across the state? Right now, the state worker's unions are arguing that significant job cuts could devastate the economy, because there are so many of them. Let me repeat that, significant state job cuts could devastate the economy, because there are so many of them. We're reaching the full maturity of "re-distributed income."
There's no way out. We're doomed.
By the way, it's summer. Be careful out in the woods. This year, you're going to run into more people living in tents. They may be hungry.
With tongue only slightly in cheek.
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Post by snickers on May 13, 2009 20:03:35 GMT -5
Of COURSE the unions are saying the State cannot fire their members. That's their job; to insist that they are indispensable. It seems to me that if these people all truly did jobs we cannot do without, it would be pretty obvious - and they wouldn't need the strongarm-thug approach of proving it.
I say, call their bluff. Fire the deadweight. Surely we can survive with, for example, only 4 "workers" standing around any given pothole at any given time. The truly useful, productive workers will prevail. The others - hey, we shouldn't have to be held hostage by them.
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Post by Swimmy on May 13, 2009 20:49:12 GMT -5
Where's Swampfox? There's that "begs the question" misuse again! Clarence? Anyway .... while I agree in principle with the editorial, we're too far down the road for any meaningful change. Albany or any other government is not going to get fixed any time soon. Cutting spending means cutting jobs. That won't happen while the state is teetering on bankruptcy. Can you imagine what would happen to 10,000 or so out-of work state workers in Albany? Or more across the state? Right now, the state worker's unions are arguing that significant job cuts could devastate the economy, because there are so many of them. Let me repeat that, significant state job cuts could devastate the economy, because there are so many of them. We're reaching the full maturity of "re-distributed income." There's no way out. We're doomed. By the way, it's summer. Be careful out in the woods. This year, you're going to run into more people living in tents. They may be hungry. With tongue only slightly in cheek. You ok, Dave? Your post is kinda gloomy. There is always hope! |
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Post by clarencebunsen on May 13, 2009 20:50:21 GMT -5
Dave,
Sorry I didn't read the editorial until now (my lunch was taken up with a fasinating discussion concerning asparagus rather than my usual reading). I'll fire off a burning email in the morning. A couple of the editors still like me although they seldom take my advise.
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Post by dgriffin on May 13, 2009 21:40:08 GMT -5
Well, c'mon, CB you got the con! Hahahaha!
Swimmy, yes I'm gloomy about state spending. Turns out it's my money. My taxes keep going up!
Snickers, the union's argument (that I heard this past weekend) isn't so much that what the workers do is indispensable, rather that the money state workers spend on the economy with their paychecks is indispensable. Because there so many of them!
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Will
Green Horn
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Post by Will on May 14, 2009 0:01:51 GMT -5
Hi all, As an employee of the state of New York and a dues paying member of NYSCPOBA (New York State Correction Officers Police Benevolent Association) I can say with a fair degree of certainty that this is a pissing match between the Governor and the unions. Basically, Governor Patterson wants to get his hand on the stimulus money from Obama so he can build a high speed commuter train between Buffalo and Albany. So far he can't get that money because Obama won't give it to the state until the union contracts are settled. NYSCOPBA is seperated into different sectors. Arbitration eligible Law enforcement members and non Arbitration eligible members. Basically this breaks down as follows: Correction Officers (peace officer status) - Arbitration Eligible SHTA's (Security Hospital Treatment Assistants) (non Arbitration eligible - No peace officer status) Arbitration means that CO's are eligible to go to binding arbitration. So if the governor will not settle the union contract the unions and the Governors office of employee relations (GOER) go to see an independent arbitrator. Both sides are heard and then a decision of the contract is made by the arbitrator. The CO's, about a week ago got their contract in binding arbitration while their union brothers (SHTA's) are left behind, now 4 years without a contractual raise all the while the cost of living continues to go up. Both state titles are salary grade 14 and pay the same dues in NYSCOPBA. Both titles deal with convicted NYS inmates. However, SHTA's deal with the most dangerous inmates from every correctional facility in the state of New York. The New York State dept. of Civil Service has deemed the title of SHTA as the single most dangerous title in the state. SHTA's are employed at Central New York Psychiatric Center in Marcy NY. I am an SHTA employed there. Job Requirements: Correction Officer: High school diploma or GED and a valid NYS drivers license. SHTA: Bachelors degree and 2 years of work experience and valid NYS drivers license. Correction Officers are given lots of tools to deal with inmates. They have CS gas (tear gas), pepper spray, batons, handcuffs, shields, firearms and a variety of other resources. SHTA's who deal with inmates far too dangerous to be dealt with in a prison setting are given nothing but rubber gloves, a 5 point restraint bed and our verbal counseling skills. The only time we are given handcuffs to use are during outside transport to a hospital for example and during that time the inmate is cuffed and shackled in the same way that CO's do. However, when a correction officer takes an inmate to a hospital there are always 2 correction officers, one of which is armed with a smith and wesson .38 special. When an SHTA takes an inmate to a hospital we are unarmed. You'll see us often at St. Lukes ER or ST. Elizabeth's ER, plain clothed and unarmed with a shackled inmate. Same goes for funeral trips. Those are significantly more dangerous. The family obviously knows we are coming with their inmate family member. Whats to stop any one of them from just taking him home? What do we do if approached with a gun? Hmmmm, "take him, he's all yours". SHTA's are injured on a daily basis on the job. Often times we can just be sitting there and from behind we are punched in the head for no reason. The Oneida County DA won't prosecute these inmates for assault stating and this is an exact quote "Their crazy, and that's your job." It's my job to get beat up? I have been an employee of NYS for 12 years, 4 of them at CNYPC in Marcy. In those 4 years I have had my nose broken, ankle sprained, back injured 4 times, thumb hyper-extended, and my knee injured to the point of micro-fractures in my knee cap and a torn medial meniscus and required knee surgery. Recently I saw the doctor for my knee 2 years after the initial injury and was told I'll need at some point in the future a total knee replacement. This is the norm at my facility where injuries are commonplace. Yet we can't get the same raise or benefits are our brothers the CO's. Now the CO's got theirs and we wait. Patterson recently asked all state workers to forfeit our 2009 raises (about $25 extra a paycheck) and defer 5 days pay until death or retirement to help offset the budget deficiency. Tell me, what am I gonna do with the 5 days pay in the event of my death? When he found out he cant legally do that he sent us (all state workers) this letter: www.utica912ers.com/Forum/download/file.php?id=1 (PDF format. and sorry for the outside link but seems relevant) So now he wants to lay people off and advises us to tell our union leaders that losing 5 days pay and our raises is preferable to being laid off. Hmmm, that's called union busting and his actions are totally unconstitutional. Sure, I agree, state workers got a bad rep. We have 2 speeds, slow and stop. But I ask you, is my job useless. Whom will watch over these people when department of corrections won't. Search the national sex offender registry and see how many registered sex offenders are in Marcy NY, 13403. Those "people" are all living at CNYPC in the sex offender treatment program. But that's another story in itself. There is no "bluff", the governor is wrong here. Unions are not using "strongarm-thug approach" tactics. They are fighting for me and my family. And I truly believe the economy would suffer. In the past week I spent over $4000 on home remodeling at LOCAL businesses. Would I have spent that if I had no job or if I was making $10 an hour at APAC? Doubtful. Support the unions! |
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Will
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Post by Will on May 14, 2009 0:05:04 GMT -5
It's my opinion that David Patterson is the worst Governor NY has had.
He has already admitted to cheating on his wife "Many times" and doing coke is now imposing 88 new bs taxes on us. Hey how about how clipping some of these high level people who get paid ridiculous salaries.
The Draconian plan calls for:
* An "iTunes tax" of 4 percent on videos, music or pictures downloaded from the Internet.
* A 4 percent tax on taxi, limo and bus rides. That means a $10 cab ride would cost 40 cents more.
* A 4 percent entertainment tax on tickets to movies, concerts and sporting events. That would add nearly 50 cents to a $12 movie ticket or $1.80 to the cheapest $44.50 seat at a Knicks game.
* The tax on beer increases 24 cents per gallon, or more than double the current rate, which means about 30 cents a case.
* An 18 percent tax on nondiet soft drinks, which aims to reduce child obesity. A $1.50 can of Pepsi would then cost at least 25 cents more.
* A 4 percent tax on cable TV and satellite services, raising a $100 bill by $4.
* Hiking the cost of "personal" services - including haircuts, manicures, pedicures, massages and gym memberships - by 4 percent.
* A 4 percent sales tax on clothing and shoes under $500, except for two weeks out of the year.
* Elimination of the law that caps the state sales tax on gasoline at 8 cents per gallon.
This is from the same person who ask everyone to freeze spending then got caught giving his own top aides raises.
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Post by Ralph on May 14, 2009 0:50:47 GMT -5
Ten bucks says that if he slips at the top of the Capital steps, no one reaches out to stop his fall.
Twenty says they drag him back up and let him do it again!!!
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Will
Green Horn
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Post by Will on May 14, 2009 1:28:29 GMT -5
Ten bucks says that if he slips at the top of the Capital steps, no one reaches out to stop his fall. Twenty says they drag him back up and let him do it again!!! How bout ya give me 20 bucks to laugh and point and take pictures when it happens... LoL Spot on Ralph.  |
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Post by Ralph on May 14, 2009 1:37:17 GMT -5
So long as you don't catch me in one throwing the banana peels out there!!! ;D
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Post by Swimmy on May 14, 2009 5:39:59 GMT -5
It's my opinion that David Patterson is the worst Governor NY has had. He has already admitted to cheating on his wife "Many times" and doing coke . . . . I would hardly hold that against him. If it wasn't for Spitzer's scandal, Patterson may never have felt compelled to come forward about any of it. I'm sure other government officials are guilty of doing the same things. Bill Clinton cheated on his wife, and the majority of the country foolishly believes he was the best president in history. Though, I do agree he is a horrible governor. And he started out so promising too! |
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Post by dgriffin on May 14, 2009 8:35:32 GMT -5
There are in fact so many state workers in NY that everyone is torn over the costs and the taxes. My son and son-in-law are state workers. Me, I'm just a taxpayer. No one involved in this issue (excepting politicians with their own agenda, of course) wants those who work for the state to exist on peon wages. I think we all just want to see less of them. The question then arises as to how many jobs are essential.
There's no easy answer, either. But the question must be answered if ANYONE in the US in the future will NOT be working for the government. Something is wrong when the best jobs today in my town are government jobs and the highest paid workers as a group are the teachers. That leaves the rest of the population to support them, often in a life style that is less than that enjoyed by those being supported by taxes.
There was a time in this country when people chose government service because of a sense of duty or because of the steadiness of the work. They expected less pay than in the private sector, but exchanged that option for either or both of the above aspects of the job. These folks were also fully aware they were living on the fruits of the profits of others, and gave good service because of it. This was an important distinction, that it was the private sector that was generating the profits to pay for the services provided by the civil service. That although civil servants were certainly not unworthy, they did not produce the profits that fueled the economy (at that time), grew wealth and continued the forward movement of the economy and society.
I know the day is long gone when a DMVehicle worker will act like a servant and call you "Sir,", but I think if we as a people are to survive a headlong dive into the oblivion of socialism and the tyranny of bureaucracy, we'd best be getting started.
(Dave leaving the lectern.)
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Post by Swimmy on May 14, 2009 12:30:21 GMT -5
I have noticed that times have changed. It used to be you went to work for the government because you were public servant minded and felt a sense of duty. Then, there was a big push to make government jobs more competitive with private sector jobs. Proponents of that movement are now just seeing the consequences of that push.
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Post by dgriffin on May 14, 2009 15:49:45 GMT -5
In "Isaac's Storm, " the story of the Galveston hurricane of 1900, (great read!), the United States Weather Bureau in Washington had less than 20 people there at headquarters and 2 or 3 workers in each field office in major cities. Don't think it took more people to predict hazardous weather. The Cubans had less people in their weather bureau and regularly and accurately predicted Gulf hurricanes that the US refused to account as accurate, including the devastating storm that hit Galveston like a tidal wave.
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