Obama Wrong On Mexico's Guns

[dgriffin]

FactCheck.Org





Counting Mexico's Guns

April 17, 2009


President Obama says 90 percent of Mexico's recovered crime guns come the U.S. Not true.


Summary


There's no dispute that thousands of handguns, military style rifles and other firearms are purchased in the U.S. and end up in the hands of Mexican criminals each year. It's relatively easy to buy such guns legally Texas and other border states and to smuggle them across.

But is it true as President Obama said, that "More than 90 percent of the guns recovered in Mexico come from the United States?" No, it's not.

The figure represents only the percentage of crime guns that have been submitted by Mexican officials and traced by U.S. officials. We can find no hard data on the total number of guns actually "recovered in Mexico," but U.S. and Mexican officials both say that Mexico recovers more guns that it submits for tracing. Therefore, the percentage of guns "recovered" and traced to U.S. sources necessarily is less than 90 percent.

Furthermore, the 90 percent figure is based on a badly biased sample of all Mexican crime guns. Law enforcement officials say Mexico asks the U.S. to trace only those guns with serial numbers or other markings that indicate they are likely to have come though the U.S.

Fox News has put the percentage at only 17 percent, but we find that to be based on a mistaken assumption that throws its figure way off. We can't offer a precise calculation because we know of no hard information on the total number of guns Mexican officials have recovered. But if a rough figure given by Mexico's attorney general is accurate, then the actual percentage of all Mexican crime guns traced to U.S. sources is probably less than half what the president claims, and more than double what Fox news has reported.
Note: This is a summary only. The full article with analysis, images and citations may be viewed on our Web site:

www.factcheck.org/politics/counting_mexicos_guns.html

[dgriffin]

From FactCheck.org.

This is what I like about these people.



Dear Subscriber: We are correcting our April 17 article "Counting Mexico's Guns" and sending this revised Summary to our list.

We originally concluded that Obama’s 90 percent figure was “not true” and based on a “badly biased” sample of recovered guns. We are retracting both those characterizations. The 90 percent figure is not supported by government statistics, but we cannot prove it is wrong.

Our error was to think we had confirmed that Mexican officials submit for tracing only those guns they believe likely to have come from the U.S. Law enforcement officials say they don't know if that's the case.

We have corrected the article throughout. We apologize for this mistake.

-Brooks Jackson
Director, FactCheck.org

Counting Mexico's Guns
April 17, 2009
Updated: April 22, 2009
President Obama says 90 percent of Mexico's recovered crime guns come from the U.S. That's not what the statistics show.
Summary
There's no dispute that thousands of handguns, military-style rifles and other firearms are purchased in the U.S. and end up in the hands of Mexican criminals each year. It's relatively easy to buy such guns legally in Texas and other border states and to smuggle them across.

But is it true, as President Obama said, that "[m]ore than 90 percent of the guns recovered in Mexico come from the United States?" Government statistics don’t actually support that claim.

The figure represents only the percentage of crime guns that have been submitted by Mexican officials and traced by U.S. officials. We can find no hard data on the total number of guns actually "recovered in Mexico," but U.S. and Mexican officials both say that Mexico recovers more guns than it submits for tracing. Therefore, the percentage of guns "recovered" and traced to U.S. sources necessarily is less than 90 percent. Where do the others come from? U.S. officials can’t say.

Fox News has put the percentage of guns that have been traced to U.S. sources at only 17 percent, but we find that to be based on a mistaken assumption that throws its figure way off. We can't offer a precise calculation because we know of no hard information on the total number of guns Mexican officials have recovered. But if a rough figure given by Mexico's attorney general is accurate, then the actual percentage of all Mexican crime guns that have been traced to U.S. sources is more than double what Fox News has reported.


"When they were wrong, they promptly admitted it."

[Ralph]

Maybe they're importing used stuff that the IRA doesn't need anymore?

Or perhaps surplus stuff from Guatemala sans the rust remover?

While I will concede that they could come from "anywhere", the US is still the best bet.

But I do see where this is leading.....if we can't get them neither can the Mexicans, soooooo.........

Better stock up whilst we can! ;D

[dgriffin]

Better stock up whilst there are so many Americans (so we're told) who feel like this idiot on "The Obama Forum." I've interspersed my thoughts.

"Every year millions of people across the world die. Every year millions of guns are manufactured across the world. It's clear that there is a strong correlation between gun manufacture and gun related deaths. This has been proven in many scientific studies like this one. So why on earth are guns still manufactured? Same with many manufacturered items, including automobiles.

While there is no question that guns are needed for war, are they really needed for civilian use? This study proves that over 85% of shootings occur AT home, not in some far away warzone but AT home. Which is interesting, since probably almost 100% of people ARE at home for more than half the day.


I'm not going to stand here and ask "what can we do about this?" because the answer is plain as day - we need a national ban on firearms in America. Most of us sit here ...

So why do so many Americans disagree with banning firearms?

Well there are three reasons. Some people like shooting at non-human objects but this is just pointless anyway so it isn't really an argument. Huh? Fishing is pointless, and so is writing on a forum on the Internet.


Another well used reason is that Americans need handguns to defend themselves. These two studies prove that civilians with guns do more harm than good. Lets face it, criminals are always going to get the first shot anyway. The public schools of America taught this person to think.

The final reason is because Americans think it is their right to be able to carry guns around and kill people indiscriminately. Well this might be true but it makes you think. Uh huh.

So what I propose is for a total nationwide ban on guns. All that you have to do is ban manufacture of ammunition. Guns will soon disapear that way...even from the criminals. Just like liquor did during the prohibition.

It's about time that America woke up to the truth - guns kill, not people."
I am now feeling like killing someone indiscriminately.

Also, it occurs to me that Tony Soprano must be drooling at the possibility of the Democrats creating out of thin air a tremendous increase to the contraband weaponry that his organization profits from selling. That's what will happen when they're banned. A legitimate industry will be replaced by off shore manufacturers making guns for on-shore criminal organizations. Who don't pay sales tax.
theobamaforum.com/archive/index.php/t-2296.html

[frankcor]

Thanks for posting that link, Dave. I've asked the school district and library to enter it into their netnanny software.

[dgriffin]

Hahaha! Do they still trust their children to NetNanny? Google a Breast of Chicken and you got your knuckles wrapped.

I posted the url in case anyone thought I was making it up!

[Ralph]

And when guns are gone people will resort to knives, sticks and stones.

Welcome the "good old days" of the zip gun!

[corner]

Apr 24, 2009 0:54:57 GMT -5 Ralph said:

Maybe they're importing used stuff that the IRA doesn't need anymore?

Or perhaps surplus stuff from Guatemala sans the rust remover?

While I will concede that they could come from "anywhere", the US is still the best bet.

But I do see where this is leading.....if we can't get them neither can the Mexicans, soooooo......... hows about the surplus sent to south america by reagan during the iran contra scandals of the 80's most of the ordanance recovered is military in nature

Better stock up whilst we can! ;D

[corner]

hows about the surplus sent to south america by reagan during the iran contra scandals of the 80's most of the ordanance recovered is military in nature

[gearofzanzibar]

Or, just maybe, the reports that most of the narco's enforcers are former Mexican Army troops that grabbed their weapons and walked off the job are true.