OD vs Daily News

[tanouryjr]

I was actually excited about the Daily News. I stiil am but I'm a little disappointed. When I announced my plan to cut the legislature, I made sure to send them the press release too. They never reported it, yet they take stories from other news sources and print them. Hmmm.

[dgriffin]

Larry, was that a one time rejection, or are they regularly dismissing your news releases? Of course, I'm not a fan of political news releases, but I guess the newspaper or online entity should treat everyone fairly if they claim they're objective.

[frankcor]

Yikes, what would have happened to Lopez if he didn't come up with the $5,000 bail?

[Clipper]

I also have noticed the errors and misspelled words on the Daily News site Frank. I am hoping with time, that they find themselves editing more thoroughly.

Nancy Ford is on staff as editor in chief. She was at the OD when I was there, and she is a very talented reporter and excellent photojournalist. Hopefully, she will get her feet under her in this new postition and clean up the writing on the new page.

I DO find the reporting to be a little more detailed and better than what we have grown to hate at the OD. Donna may be a stickler for writing errors, but she is not too hot on insisting on accuracy in reporting the location of, and other facts pertinent to the news being reported, and other important issues.

I think what we are seeing is an attempt to get a foot in the door of local news reporting on line, so when the OD bites the dust as a printed publication, and Gatehouse pulls the plug in Utica, we will have a viable source already up and running. I am sure that the Utica Daily News will have growing pains, and will require fine tuning as they grow. I am giving them a chance, because I grow increasingly disgusted, day by day, with the bias and lousy reporting at the OD.

As I said the other day on one thread or another, I see the Rome Daily Sentinel surviving as the predominant printed newspaper in the area, and possibly adding a "Utica Edition" or a Utica section to the Rome paper. That leaves the online arena open to competition, and I have to say that I am not at all impressed with the Rome Sentinel's homepage.

I also think that you will see the Herkimer Telegram expand in the valley when the OD is gone, and will publish a bigger daily paper and serve a larger circulation area. Sundays will probably see a Rome Sentinel Sunday Edition, distributed from Little Falls to Oneida or Canastota, with all the syndicated comics and national advertising inserts included.

[dgriffin]

Clipper, I'm not familiar with the numbers, but it's hard to see any newspaper expanding INTO Utica from either Rome or Herkimer. In fact, the Sentinel and the Telegram must be under the same economic pressures as the OD and may be in similar trouble. While they might like the increased circulation Utica would provide, and would make an attempt to cover Utica news, I've seen examples where that plan often fails when the out of town paper doesn't get it right.

I wouldn't think the OD is failing due to reader resentment or editorial policy. Newspapers are just a dying paradigm. I buy my local daily not for their crack reporting or their tremendous editorial insight, of which the are bereft of both, but because Mrs. Dave tells me to buy it so she can read the ads. I don't read the ads, and I get my news on the Internet. So if I survive Mrs. Dave (she doubts it), I will be one less customer of the local daily. (I'd probably buy USA Today. Local events in this state are driven by Albany, so local news is always the same from town to town .. a megadump, the taxes, assessments, etc. Seriously, when I tire of reading my town's local news, I switch to Woodstock's newspaper, and then back when I tire of theirs. It's all the same, pretty much, except for rumors about the librarian.)

[dgriffin]

A related thought. I MIGHT buy a daily paper for its quality reporting and wise insights ... I could become a loyal and appreciative customer ... but the likelihood of finding one with those attributes on the local scene is quite small. That's because economic pressures and a corporate mentality have resulted in papers hiring mostly kids, who haven't yet developed those qualities.

And that may be true of web based news outlets. I think it's fine you're understanding of the UticaDailyNews' startup problems, but for myself I could be absolutely appalled that any self-respecting journalist would allow that level of quality out the door. I'm reminded of the response I received from the WKTV News Director when I wrote to him about poor writing on his news site. He agreed that such low quality was lamentable, but he doubted he'd be able to do anything about it. How terrible.

[Clipper]

I posted to the CNY forum about just that problem Dave, and I would hope that a little more attention would be paid to proper spelling and wording by people with their experience. Nancy Ford was with the OD for about 10 or 15 years and was always a great photojournalist, but I don't remember a whole lot about her writing. Donna WAS always a stickler for such things as verbage etc.

At a printed paper, the first copies off the press are proof read by a mulitude of employees, and each member of the press room crew takes a certain section, or certain number of pages, and proof reads them for spelling, grammar, as well as print quality and press issues. Many of the rest of us read the first few copies, while waiting for the press to come up to speed and for the first bundles to reach my transportation loading docks. Proofreaders also came down to production from the news room and made any changes to the printing plates that were identified by those of us proofing the copies.

I guess I am more forgiving because I become more digusted daily, with the quality of reporting, and the unfettered bias at the OD.

[dgriffin]

Yup. I copied my post of UDN errors to the Letter To The Editor thread on the CNY Forum. Nancy Ford is one hell of a photographer. I've been to her site. I really like her stuff. Your comments about reading the paper as it came off the press reminded me of my Dad doing the same, as a pressman for the OD. He was mainly looking for typos and impression, of course.

I think you might be taking problems at the OD too seriously, or even personally, Clip. The same conditions affecting Donna and the gang are at work in other newspapers in the US, with often the same results, although some other papers may meet their challenges with more grace. That's all the counsel I have for you tonight, my son. Hahahaha!

[tanouryjr]

Mar 21, 2009 18:05:33 GMT -5 @dgriffin said:

Larry, was that a one time rejection, or are they regularly dismissing your news releases? Of course, I'm not a fan of political news releases, but I guess the newspaper or online entity should treat everyone fairly if they claim they're objective.

It was the first time I've sent a news release to them, Dave. That's why I'm not that worried about it. I'm still very excited about their site. I didn't really consider it "political" though. It was an actually Law that I have drafted and submitted for consideration. When election time comes, I always understand that certain "political" releases aren't going to get coverage. But I do expect the media to report on actual legislative action. How else is the public to stay informed?

[frankcor]

Dave that thing about me and the librarian is a complete falsehood.

[dgriffin]

I just love librarians. Always have.

[dgriffin]

Just a note to say I've received a cordial reply from the UticaDailyNews regarding my letter to the editor and am seeking permission to copy it here.

[Clipper]

Dave, my personal take on the situation at the OD, and the possibility of the Sentinel surviving and expanding is based on a couple of points. The OD is constantly sucked dry by corporate greed and "AIG like" executives that have never even been to Utica NY. The Sentinel has always been small enough and well managed enough to survive this move to online news. As long as there is any printed news at all, I think the smaller, less sophisticated, news outlets stand a better chance than those that are top heavy and controlled by executives that have no idea what the local needs are, and don't want to hear about them. Believe me when I say, THAT IS A TRUE FACT at the OD. At least it was under Gannet's Banner.

Unfortunately I DO see the OD folding it's tent and going a way sometime in the future. I DON'T see the Sentinel following suit, as they are much more locally oriented, and are respected by their readers.

The Rome Daily Sentinel, and The Herkimer Telegram are both small enough, with a small enough payroll, to survive while the corporate giant goes broke. Advertising revenue is most likely going to still exist in sufficient quantity to support the small local operation of those two.

I have to express an opinion, having managed the transportation department at the OD for a couple of years. People have grown disgusted with the OD for several reasons, and one of them is service. The old press breaks down frequently. When the press breaks down the papers are late. When a paper is scheduled to come off the press at one specific time, and it doesn't come to the loading dock until 3 hours later, it is impossible for it to be delivered to the stores, vending machines, and to the home delivery customer on time. Most people that work, want their paper in the tube when they wake up and sit down with their coffee.

The OD also has alienated subscribers with their biased reporting, and lack of concern for the wants of the readers. The biased reporting, coupled with lousy service and late papers causes a major downslide in the whole operation. Disgusted readers go online, and printed paper readers that don't have internet are left with no alternative source of news, other than the TV news at 6 and 11.

The loss of subscribers, ends up equating to lower circulation numbers. Lower circulation numbers make it harder to sell advertising space. Less advertising revenue causes a profit loss of large magnitude, and eventually the whole house of cards will cave in.

I have to think there is always going to be a place in our lives for a printed newspaper. I can't imagine my working years without being able to grab the morning paper on my way to work, to peruse over my morning coffee. I don't see families that browse through the Sunday morning inserts and ads, doing that on the computer. Paper advertising is always going to have a market, however limited it may become.

Bottom line, after all this blather, is that YES, I can see the OD failing at some point, and YES, I do see the Rome Daily Sentinel in a position to expand in some form, into the Utica area, for lack of any other printed news. All that would be necessary would be an earlier press start time, and additional circulation and distribution folks, coupled with a Utica office to house subscription sales, and a reporter or two. Their meager facilities are perfectly capable of the increase in circulation.

[dgriffin]

I might indeed be a victim of "it's always been there," so it's hard to believe the Utica OD could go away. When I was a little kid, I thought the city was named after the newspaper.

And I understand well your point that a corporate culture (rhymes with vulture) can suck a local operation dry and put the endeavor in a lousy competitive position. Some outfits are better managed by folks who look at the long run and opt for a better balance of quality and profits. That's assuming the papers you mention indeed are, and I'll take your word for it.

By the way, are the OD presses you refer to the first offset presses installed in the 70's? Those were used and in poor shape then. But they must have replaced them by now.

I shouldn't be in this discussion, knowing so little of the particulars of the OD and Gatehouse.
But I am aware the entire newspaper industry is in tough shape, and I have to conclude the OD suffers problems common to all the papers. However, if your point is that all newspapers have been brought to the brink, but the OD is closer to or half way over the precipice due its unique set of failings, then I could accept that argument.

[Clipper]

PS: Thanks for the fatherly counsel and your sage wisdom. You have much more knowledge of the printed news business, than I could have possibly assimilated from a meager two years. LOL.

I simply have seen the unmerciful beating that circulation people take from corporate, in attempting to bolster subscription numbers that simply do not exist any more with the declining population, coupled with the move to online news.

Corporate management wants magic, and doesn't want to pay for it. They want the papers delivered and delivered on time, but they balk at any thought of increasing the fuel subsistence to the contractors, or the wages to the company drivers. (It is ALL contracted now at the OD)

I worked for the government during a time when we were forced to learn to "do more with less", and were able to cut our budget by 27% one particular year. It was not a case of my not knowing how to manage a budget. At the OD under Gannet rule, they wanted us to learn to do so much with so little that it became impossible to accomplish. Things must have changed with contracted help, but when it got to where I could not hire enough drivers, and ended up delivering skips and shortages myself, after the bundles were off the dock, I just said the hell with it and quit. We were paying men $6.35 to wade through snow up to their butts, and rain that would run down the crack of their butt, in the middle of the night, many times in dangerous areas of the city. I guess Donna could never understand why people weren't beating down the doors to be considered for that "wonderful career opportunity" LOL.

hey, have a good day "DAD" LOLOL!