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Post by dgriffin on Feb 25, 2009 18:37:39 GMT -5
 Fact-Checking Obama's SpeechFebruary 25, 2009 The president gets facts wrong about oil imports, mortgage aid and the transcontinental railroad, and more.SummaryPresident Obama's first speech to a joint session of Congress was stuffed with signals about the new direction his budget will take and meant-to-be reassuring words about the economy. But it was also peppered with exaggerations and factual misstatements. * He said "we import more oil today than ever before." That's untrue. Imports peaked in 2005 and are substantially lower today. * He claimed his mortgage aid plan would help "responsible" buyers but not those who borrowed beyond their means. But even prominent defenders of the program including Fed Chairman Bernanke and FDIC chief Bair concede foolish borrowers will be aided, too. * He said the high cost of health care "causes a bankruptcy in America every 30 seconds." That's at least double the true figure. * He flubbed two facts about American history. The U.S. did not invent the automobile, and the transcontinental railroad was not completed until years after the Civil War, not during it. * He claimed that his stimulus plan "prevented the layoffs" of 57 police officers in Minneapolis. In fact, it's far more complicated than that, and other factors are also helping to save police jobs. The president also repeated some strained claims we've critiqued before. MORE at: www.factcheck.org/politics/fact-hecking_obamas_speech.html |
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Post by stoney on Feb 25, 2009 19:53:42 GMT -5
It wasn't extremely exaggerated at all. Is this a Limbaugh-sponsored site?
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Post by dan on Feb 25, 2009 20:42:12 GMT -5
It wasn't extremely exaggerated at all. Is this a Limbaugh-sponsored site? Facts are facts, unless your rewriting history. Then facts are "inconvenient", like the truth. |
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Post by Clipper on Feb 25, 2009 22:53:26 GMT -5
I don't know about this being a "limbaugh sponsored site" stoney, but I personally voted against Obama, but have since reconsidered some of my former reasoning, and I am impressed with his desire to really bring about "change". I simply want, as do most people, to see what comprises the "change" he has in mind. He has already come to be known as a great speaker and orator. What is important, if he is to be such a powerful speaker, is for him to insure that the contents of his speeches are factual. The campaign is over. During a campaign, we don't expect facts (and that is a fact), but when the man took office, he became responsible for knowing what is fact and what is fiction, and can not simply baffle the American people with bullshit when he is not able to dazzle them with brilliance. He looks like an ignorant ass when he makes such statements as the statement about the transcontinental railroad, or the first automobile. Throngs of us regular everyday people have a basic knowledge of history and KNOW that he was not speaking from fact. I am impressed with the young man's ambition, and his desire to make things better, but he better get over the "talking" and get on with the "doing". It does nothing for HIS integrity when he cannot forumlate a cabinet of HONEST people that can be confirmed without some embarrassing fact coming to light about their private or political life. It is a rocky start. He is saddled with the economic crisis, whether it be a republican caused problem or democrat caused problem. It is an American problem now, and HE is going to have to deal with it. Republicans need to lay down their swords and pick up their pens. They need to work with democrats to come up with bipartisan legislation that will bring the country through the depression that we are experiencing. For years the democrats had nothing in mind but to get revenge for the 2000 election. Now is a time when our country's survival mandates that we put aside the bullshit school playground games and work together in unity to accomplish the necessary changes to bring about economic stability, and work together to successfully WIN the war on terror and to agree on a bipartisan plan to bring our troops home, but to bring them home victorious. No LIMBAUGH here. Just good American's expecting intelligent and factual information from a new president that needs to calm the seas of partisanship, and rally the whole country behind a program to put the USA back on top as a world power and defender of freedom for ALL people worldwide. His attempts to reach across the aisle are admirable. I hope he succeeds in bringing the entire congress and senate together for the good of all. Oh yeah, in case ya didn't catch it anywhere else on the forum, WELCOME BACK STONEY!  |
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Post by dgriffin on Feb 26, 2009 6:35:00 GMT -5
It wasn't extremely exaggerated at all. Is this a Limbaugh-sponsored site? I've been reading FactCheck since their inception a few years ago, and have found them generally accurate and fair. If anything, they tend toward the liberal side, since they are a unit of the Annenburg Public Policy Center at the University of Pennsylvania. From their website: "The Annenberg Public Policy Center of the University of Pennsylvania performs research in the fields of political communication, information and society, media and the developing child, health communication and adolescent risk. The Policy Center's goal is to provide expert analysis that brings these issues into focus." I've read that FactCheck has inspired many in the news media to to better question statements made by politicians, and a few newspapers now have similar regular features. Better than Op Ed, where notables are allowed to simply spout their opinions, FactCheck researches and publishes the real data. They're not perfect of course, but I've seldom seen them get it very wrong. |
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Post by frankcor on Feb 26, 2009 7:20:01 GMT -5
When I heard Obama say the automobile was invented in the US, I thought to myself "I'll bet Karl Benz is spinning in his grave, right now." Maybe the President screwed up reading the teleprompter and was attempting to attribute the invention of lousy automobiles that nobody wants to buy to the US?
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Post by dgriffin on Feb 26, 2009 9:48:18 GMT -5
I'll bet his speech writers are being drawn and quartered. Those are stupid mistakes, to get history wrong. Here .... let me play speech writer and google "automobile invented where?" Top result is: www.loc.gov/rr/scitech/mysteries/auto.htmlKarl Benz in Germany! Then I'll google "U.S. Transcontinental railroad." Top result is Wiki, which says it was completed in 1869, four years after the end of the Civil War. Do you think I should email the White House with this information?  |
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Post by stoney on Feb 26, 2009 10:17:01 GMT -5
I always thought Henry Ford invented the automobile, as probably many others do. Is that really such a bad flub? C'mon, now. I could easily find a lot of ridiculous stuff Bush said, too.
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Post by dgriffin on Feb 26, 2009 10:46:59 GMT -5
I always thought Henry Ford invented the automobile, as probably many others do. Is that really such a bad flub? C'mon, now. I could easily find a lot of ridiculous stuff Bush said, too. From a professional point of view, given it was a presentation to the United States Congress , yes I think those were stupid flubs. And also suspcious is the fact that no news outlet reported it, even though it's inconceivable that none of their fact-checking staff noticed it. But realistically, I'd be more concerned about his overstating the oil imports, the (purposeful?) ambiguity of which borrowers get mortgage aid, and the overstatement of medical bankruptcies by doubling the number. None of that fits the image he's trying to build, where he's the good guy, the lone knight, the one you can trust. I truly wish the guy well, and I don't envy the road ahead of him. But if he doesn't hold to a rigorous path of honesty and purpose, he'll wind up being just another bum in the White House. |
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Post by Clipper on Feb 26, 2009 11:52:02 GMT -5
Hell Stoney, Bush was NOTED for his stupid remarks and misquotes. He simply had a poor grasp of the English language, and speech writers that were as incapable of addressing the issues as he was.
Obama has been noted as a great orator and very gifted speaker. He MUST be more careful to make sure that his speeches are accurate, informed, and not in conflict with something he has said in the recent past. People are holding him to his promise of "change" and the change needs to be something new and beneficial to the country, not just some more rhetoric, and speeches with no workable action plan. The American people are sick of partisan bullshit, and want serious bipartisan cooperation to address both the economic crisis and the war on terror.
Now that HE is sitting in the seat of responsibility, I have to think he is re-thinking some of his criticism of GW. He is finding that campaigning is a whole different ball game from running a country in crisis.
The war between the parties on Capital Hill needs to halt with some sort of cease fire, and the two parties need to really reach across the aisle and work together to address the issues at hand. We are in a position on the world stage to lose alot of face, if we cannot once again present a united front at home, and once again lead the world as the fair and friendly "face" of democracy, as well as the powerful image as the strongest military power in the world. In-fighting is going to destroy us if we don't work together to make a plan that works, and get with the program.
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Post by gearofzanzibar on Feb 26, 2009 13:09:50 GMT -5
I always thought Henry Ford invented the automobile, as probably many others do. Is that really such a bad flub? C'mon, now. Not at all, but it is instructive. Unless I'm miscounting, for which I apologize in advance, every person in this thread that didn't support Mr. Obama's candidacy was aware of the actual facts. His supporters? Not so much. C'mon, that's just plain funny. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Man, those smilies are growing on me. Of course you can. When Pres. Bush flubbed it was yet another example of his lowbrow, idiotic, stupid mentality. When Pres. Obama flubbs it's a simple oversight that doesn't really matter. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Welcome to the Obamanation (TM). |
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Post by gearofzanzibar on Feb 26, 2009 13:16:03 GMT -5
The war between the parties on Capital Hill needs to halt with some sort of cease fire, and the two parties need to really reach across the aisle and work together to address the issues at hand. Bipartisanship is horribly over-rated. A silly idea doesn't become any less silly just because you can get a politician from across the aisle to support it. See also: TARP, Patriot Act, etc... Partisanship is good. If anything, the level of co-operation between parties at the Federal level is at an unprecedented high. When the days of duels and horse-whipping on the floor of Congress return I'll get worried about partisan politics. |
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Post by frankcor on Feb 26, 2009 14:47:13 GMT -5
heh heh heh ...
he said horse-whip
heh heh heh
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Post by Clipper on Feb 26, 2009 17:03:44 GMT -5
Oh dear. Frank is getting excited.
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Post by dan on Feb 26, 2009 20:44:32 GMT -5
"Obama has been noted as a great orator and very gifted speaker."
The only people that I've heard praising his oratorary skills are the usual suspects at MSNBC, CNN, The View, etc, etc, etc. His flubs either aren't reported at all or are buried. He really hasn't impressed me whenever he's more than 6 feet from a teleprompter.
Yes, yes, I know. I'm an evil partisan, but I've given him almost a whole month and haven't posted anything against him, instead I've been waiting to see some glimmer of the hope he ran on and all I've seen is $1,000,000,000,000,000.00 + of added debt for my son, grandson, great grandson, ad nausium. His first week concentrated on GITMO, Abortion rights and CAFE standards, all of which leaned absolutely left, not center. When the "stimulus" package was only in the Billions the projected cost per job created was at $217,000.00. I can't even wrap my mind around the possible 3 1/2 extra private sector jobs this $1,000,000,000,000,000.00 + taxpayer-funded welfare program will really cost us.
And don't think I'm sticking up for the past administration because I'm ragging on the current one. I'm not a big fan of the fiscal irresponsibility of the republicans either. I will admit, Barak does it with a lot more flair than those stuffy old codgers.
There, done ranting (I've been good for the last 3 months). Had to let it out sooner or later.
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