"Clean Coal" Confrontation

[dgriffin]

"Clean Coal" Confrontation

January 22, 2009


Oxymoron or goal within reach? Industry and environmentalists get down and sooty.


Summary


"On the campaign trail, President Obama embraced the coal industry's vision of "clean coal" technology. But even before he took office, a coalition of environmental groups (including Al Gore's) launched ads ridiculing the idea as a myth: "In reality, there's no such thing as clean coal."

We're sure to hear more of this debate in coming months. Burning coal creates large quantities of carbon dioxide, the most prevalent of the "greenhouse gases" that scientists say is heating up the planet and Obama has said he wants to reduce.

Is "clean coal" possible? Our answer: Probably, though it would come with a big price tag.

In our Analysis section, we try to shed a little light on the subject."

www.factcheck.org/politics/clean_coal_confrontation.html


I've been sort of following this, because it is a bit hard to believe. However, if it's possible, we have a lot of coal left that could save great amounts of oil.

[bobbbiez]

Oh no!
I don't want to clean up any more ashes.

That was my chore which I shared with my sister when we were younger and had the old coal furnace. I can still see that little shovel I learned to hate.

[bobbbiez]

Yeah sure! I can see the younger generalization doing that now.

God forbid they get their hands dirty.

[dan]

(should we let her know that clean coal is for industrial use or let her keep thinking we're returning to the stone age)?

[bobbbiez]

I was kidding around, but seriously, you never know what will happen in the future.

Never say never.

[clarencebunsen]

The best line from FactCheck:
"We find no factual misstatements in these ads, but that's because they contain practically no factual claims."

I thought their analysis of oxyfuel technology got it a little wrong. Here is another description:
www.sciam.com/blog/60-second-science/post.cfm?id=first-oxyfuel-clean-coal-power-plan-2008-09-04
At least there is no hauling out the "clinkers." My brother & I had that job, bobbiez. Ours never burned to ash, maybe because we used softer coal in the midwest.

There is no human activity that has no negative enviornmental impact. That includes breakfasting on organic whole grains and walking to your job of hunting and gathering wearing no synthetic fibers.

[Clipper]

It will all too soon come down to either making environmental "sacrifices" or going without electricity and heat. They could never build nuclear plants fast enough to keep up with the demands, or as cheaply as fossil fuel plants.

I chuckle when I hear Obama support clean coal. There was a day on the campaign trail, where he talked against coal plants and pollution while speaking somewhere in Ohio, saying there was no such thing as
clean coal" and then on his very next stop, he crawled up the asses of the coal miners about 50 miles from here, in Smyth County Virginia, and touted clean coal technology.

I don't know if the national media caught that and carried it on the national news, but our local news outlets damn sure did. He lost some votes over that one little hypocritical blunder. Maybe he thought that the local folks in Appalachia never heard of Ohio, or it is too far away for the news to travel that far, haha.

My grandparents had a coal furnace, as well as a coal and gas combo cook stove in the kitchen. I remember them having two coal bins. One contained bituminous, or "soft coal" and the other contained anthracite, or hard coal. I am not familiar with coal as a home heating fuel, but I would imagine that it had to do with price back then, and they saved money by burning some of both. I know that soft coal from the coal deposits in southern Illinois is really dusty and dirty and makes a lot of soot when it burns. My friend in Minnesota used it in his stove in a garage workshop. His brother used to bring it to him, in burlap bags, directly from the strip mines near his home in Illinois.

[Ralph]

In a billion years or so when the sun supernovas and fries this planet to a crisp, clean coal will be the least of our worries! ;D

[dgriffin]

I burned coal in my kitchen stove for heat in the 80's. I liked it, although Mrs. Dave complained of the ash in the air. (It was an old stove and not very tight.) Coal produces a lot more ash daily than wood, I can tell you, and you can't throw it on the garden, as you can wood ashes. Except for the daily hauling in of about 30 pounds of coal and the hauling out of what seemed 29 pounds of ash (I exaggerate), I found burning coal less trouble than wood. I had to tend the coal stove only twice daily, although I usually played with it three times for maximum heat output. I burned "chestnut" size coal, but remember the "stove" coal we burned at home in the furnace in Utica. Until I was about 12 years old and we moved to a place with a gas furnace. A nice even heat throughout the day and night. But more work than gas or fuel oil, of course.

[Clipper]

People here in our area are only a 1/2 hour drive from the coal fields of SW Virginia. Coal yards around here sell coal in all sizes, but what many people buy for stove coal is these huge chunks, weighing 50 or 60 pounds. They break it into smaller pieces themselves with a sledge hammer. I guess it breaks quite easily, and buying it in that configuration is much cheaper. I have friends in SW Virginia that go directly to the mine to get their coal by the pickup truck load. Cheap heat when you live close to the source.

[concerned]

I gues it will bring back the noble profession of Chimney Sweep.

[Clipper]

I will get serious about my dieting, and tie on a pair of those sneakers with coil springs on the soles, strap a wire brush to my ass, and prepare to jump down chimneys. Hey, anything for a few extra bucks. I mean, what the hell, if Santa can do it, I should be able to manage, although my mission will not be as illustrious or noble. It will definitely serve a good purpose.

What do ya think is a good price to charge for a "chimney jump" Concerned? Please consider the dangers and adjust the pay accordingly.

[dgriffin]

Jan 25, 2009 11:45:15 GMT -5 Clipper said:

What do ya think is a good price to charge for a "chimney jump" Concerned? Please consider the dangers and adjust the pay accordingly

Clipper, you'll probably want to check with the National Chimney Sweep Guild at:

www.ncsg.org/



But here's an idea, if you plan to jump head first.



en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimney_sweep

[Clipper]

OOh NOoo. Another unionized trade. Stand by folks, the chimney sweeps will be standing in line for a bail out too.

I was thinking since the springy sneaker deal still sounded dangerous for a guy that can't stay right side up on a step ladder, that maybe I should sub contract, and hire one of the freaky looking goth dudes with a hairy chest, a bushy moustache and nipple rings. I could simply tie ropes to his nipple rings and run him up and down the chimney a couple of times.

[frankcor]

Jan 25, 2009 21:30:08 GMT -5 @dgriffin said:

But here's an idea, if you plan to jump head first.

Remember: never get your ass higher than your head.