Sheriff's raise vetoed by Co. Executive

[countrygal]

While I agree that the Sheriff should get more money, I was a little concerned that he was getting a big jump in pay all at once. Couldn't they have raised it slowly?

Someone said he shouldn't have addressed this issue while in office. When's he supposed to address it......when he's not in the position anymore?

[smiley]

The logical thing would have been to raise it slowly through out the past several years. They did not do that and as a result he is grossly underpaid. I was concerned as well will the big pay jump but it is logical. He supervises over 400 employees. They have to bring the pay up to standards or no one will want the Thankless Job that Sheriff has.
The other piece of this is that the Road Patrol has been working without a contract. The law enforcement division of the Sheriffs Department is the lowest paid agency around the area.
The county executive has not made efforts to rectify the contract negotiations.
Sad Really for the Sheriff and his men!

[Clipper]

It is sad that they waited so long to give the sheriff a raise. It is even more sad that they have stonewalled the deputies for so long.

I feel badly for Middaugh, but even worse for the deputies. They have been the subject of a thread on the OD forum that has reached 20 or 21 pages. They are really behind in pay compared to others doing a comparable job.

The games that have been played with them and their negotiations are ridiculous. They face the costs of arbitration now, as do we the taxpayers. The county exec and others have delayed the inevitable raise that is due them, and simply cost the taxpayers more money in legal fees and arbitration costs.

I am sure that part of the problem now is that the union didn't endorse Picente in the election, and he is even more bitter as a result. On the other side of the coin, he could hardly expect the support of a group that he was in the process of continually screwing over for political gain.

Now these guys go to work, underpaid, increasingly in danger, and under a cloud of consolidation suggestions. If any consolidation is to be considered, it should be to consolidate town and village forces INTO the sheriff's patrol, not do away with the road patrol.

Larry Tanoury Jr. came on the other forum with an explanation of the veto by Picente of Middaugh's raise. That explanation made sense, but doesn't address the issue with the deputies contract. I have more faith in the honesty and intentions of Tanoury Jr, moreso than any of our other legislators. I only have to say, that no matter the bond rating or whatever other financial issues may prevail, the contract with the road patrol deputies and 911 dispatchers, should have been addressed long ago, and must be addressed ASAP.

I also noticed that there is a new article addressing the legislator's justification to remain 29 strong or whatever the numbers are.

All I have to say about that is that I would rather cut the number of political positons than the number of law enforcement positions. They need to put their attention on taking care of our LE officers and off of political nest feathering.

I hate to say I told ya so, but I think personally if we had Koziol in Picente's office, things would be handled in a much more expiditious manner, and much fairer to the average citizen.

Next election we need to "pull a few more weeds" from the legislature and "plant a few more seeds" like Tanoury Jr.

In the meantime, we need to go to the other forum and support the deputies periodically on the ongoing thread. I have tried to support them over there, but I am in Tennessee, and have not much to offer other than the taxes we pay in the county and the moral support I can offer the Deputies from here.

[froggy]

Why feel bad for him? Its an elected position, he knew the pay, if its not up to his standard, don't run for re-election. Its that simple. Go where the money is, and its not in Oneida county.

Besides that, he wrecked an official car while campaigning for the last election. Something that is illegal to be doing. He's lucky to be in office at all.

And if he was any bit concerned or cared about the deputies, he would forego talks of his own raise in favor of settling the contracts for the deputies. but we don't see that, we see him with his hand out, nevermind those under him who do the real work. Typical politician.

[thelma]

From what I understand, the matter of the raise now will go back to the Board who must have a majority Vote of all Legislatures to override Picente's veto. Since 24 out of 29 originally approved this raise to the Sheriff, I don't see any problem why they won't be able to over ride the Veto.

IMO - I go along with the suggestion this raise should NOT be given until the next upcoming term of the next Sheriff. Elected Officials should NOT give themselves a raise (no matter how warranted it is) while they are occupying the office themselves.

As far as Koziol goes, Clipper, I know him personally (dated my daughter a few times) and he is NOT the "great" lawyer you think he is. He makes sure he gets his name in the paper for cases he wins (as many other lawyers do but don't advertize it). If you really looked at his track record, he is a very much over-priced and highly egotistical lawyer who has lost as many cases (if not more) than he has won.

[Clipper]

That is strictly your opinion of Leo, Thelma. I doubt that the Jesus himself would have met your expectations to date your daughters, haha.

Obviously you are not the only one that feels that way, otherwise he would be county exec and would have won the election.haha. I still like and respect Koziol, and have no use for Picente. Leo is a lawyer. What is it that you don't understand? NO lawyer is UNDER priced, and no lawyer wins them all. haha!

[thelma]

Clipper - Let's just say, I know another side of Leon that the average voter doesn't know about. When I say "overpriced", I meant that he charges nearly double of what another good and reputable lawyer would charge for doing the same type of case.

His huge ego is apparent to anyone that talks to him - even on the Campaign Trail. You should know that Utica politics are based on knowing the "right" people and having them like you and work for you. Leon doesn't have this and never will.

[Clipper]

Thelma, I have to retract my opinion of Koziol. I respected him for the work he did for Larry Tanoury Jr when the city tryed to screw him over. I hated Julian, and was a great fan of anyone that stepped in his bullshit and put a stop to it. I was never so happy as when he lost the election. I can't say as I am any more impressed with Roefaro, although I liked his platform when he ran, but he doesn't seem to be living up to those promises.

I had forgotten Koziol's involvement with the citizens for equality group and his work against the OIN. I am in favor of the land trust issue, and sure do not support Koziol now that I have been reminded of his past work.

I guess I would have been in a real pickle trying to decide who to vote for to be county exec, as I don't like Picente at all either. Kinda like the Democratic primary. Do ya want the boob with two nuts or the nut with two boobs. Only choice ending up voting for another republican, just like last time, whether we are completely happy with the republican's platform or not.

It is sad that the democratic process has come down to such a poor selection in most elections, of having to pick the lesser of two evils instead of someone with a real and outstanding draw that is worth voting for confidently with a positive feeling in your heart.

Thanks lrtill for reminding me of Koziols former work against the OIN and filling me in on some of his other misadventures.

[corner]

have to agree with thelma on this one clip leon is a self indulgent self absorbed egomaniac of the highest order,he does not enjoy a good reputaion in general and among his peers, youve been away too long. as far as the sheriff getting more money the position is under funded and this large raise would be easier to takeif he wasnt running the department from the roselawn and the deputies pays were at least commensurate with the town pds

[thelma]

Corner - Thanks for the Vote of Confidence and agreeing with me re. Leon. Even Leon's wife couldn't stay married to him despite having two children with him - LOL! I think Leon has finally learned he has no place in politics, and never will have.

[Swimmy]

Well, in the legal community, koziol is the textbook definition of an ambulance chaser. He will go after anything that can make a big name for himself. A Rome City worker in the treasurer department was accused of embezzlement and was fired. The charges were later dropped in the middle of trial. koziol made it his mission to recover $30 million for her. He was literally laughed out of court when he tried to argue against summary judgment (dismissal before trial in civil suits). Those are his typical cases, with the occaisional victory like peterman v pataki, which has been rendered pointless by the federal courts and BIA.

[wcup102]

I was at the meeting the other night. So let me put my .02 in.

I applauded and commended Tanoury on the OD thread as he openly supproted the PBA in explaining his vote NO and for the fact he had the balls to come on the forum and post. That, to me, is being an individual and not another politician. He and Shannon Scott openly stated their support for us in the meeting when explaining their No votes. I did say that he statement at the meeting gave me mixed signals. He stated that he could not support a raise for the sheriff because it was so large, but stated he supports the PBA in getting a fair contact and that should be settled asap. Is he syaing "Here's your contract but sorry no money?" I just did not get it.

Also I know for a fact that the sheriff has been asking for a raise for over eight maybe ten years now. The board kept blowing it off so now we have this dilemma. Froggy, I usually agree and respect your opinions and posts, but it kind of ticked me off with your comments. He has and does support us for btter pay. As far as the car issue, he has that at his disposal 24/7. Anyway, I'm not posting to criticize, I respect your opinion Froggy and also again thank you for your support. I have known Dan personally for over 22 years and he is a true friend. But I digress.

The veto, to me, appeared to be nothing more than posturing on Picente's behalf. He knocked it down because he knows the re-vote will pass it and that will get the monkey off his back with the taxpayers because he will just say that he tried to curb spending and will save face. THAT my friends, isnot being an individual, but a politician.

[Swimmy]

I think hennesey should take his own advice and take this whole issue to court for a third opinion. If it's good for the gander it must be good for the goose. He wants the court's opinion for OIN, why not do that for every matter?!

Sarcasm aside, I agree with wcup102. While I can understand the concern about giving an elected official a pay raise in the same term, as wcup102 has pointed out, he's asked for this raise for the better part of a decade...

[thelma]

Thanks, Swimmy, for the insight into how Leon's peers judge his abilities as a lawyer - something I've know for years now.

Did you know he only pays his Legal Secretaries minimum wage? This is why he has such a turnover in secretaries. We all know that a good Legal Secretary is hard to find and when you are lucky enough to find one willing to work for you, they certainly are NOT going to work for minimum wage.

Many of his cases/decisions have been tossed out on Appeal, but he manages to keep them out of the newspapers and the average person isn't aware of how many cases he actually loses.

Leon pratices law strictly for the money - NOT because he cares for the unfortunate.

[Swimmy]

It's easy to keep civil losses from the paper. The disgrace is mostly concerned with criminal cases. The coverage they provide for the civil stuff is usually only if it's politically related or the winning attorney wants to boast about it to improve his name recognition within the readership.

At cocktail parties he's often the butt of many lawyer jokes. It's lawyers like him that give the rest of the profession such a bad reputation.