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Post by Swimmy on Jul 28, 2011 7:10:24 GMT -5
Yes, blame the lawyers who represented clients' interests. Blame the lawyers who the clients paid to represent their silly stuff that many lawyers did not think they would win. Perhaps the judges duped by the lame lawsuits, sure.
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Post by JGRobinson on Jul 28, 2011 7:41:48 GMT -5
I just wrote one of my teachers from MCS a long email on their School account, one of those bucket list things. He was one of the Good Ones", one of my Mentors, I dont think he ever knew that, not sure he cared but he didn't stop the beatings. I told him that, he still teaches and was once the Principal I think.
I hope he shares this blog, my letter and this painful story with his Colleagues, Students and Administrators. I have a great life now, Ive earned it and nobody will ever take it away from me again. The biggest tragedy in this Tale of 2 Johns would be if nothing was ever learned from this or done to prevent it from happening again.
I challenge every Citizen on Clippers to write to someone in the School you attended even if it was 50 years ago. Every one that has felt the physical and psychological agony of being the unwilling target or participant in a Public School Beat Down. Tell them it must end and they are responsible for stopping it in their schools. Please do it before another young man gets his legs broken or young girl kills herself because Boys will be boys Boys and "You know how cruel Girls can be"...
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Post by JGRobinson on Jul 28, 2011 8:01:55 GMT -5
Is it the Lawyers or Nepotizers that would choose a private investigation and non subjective punishment over clear rules, regulations, guidelines and transparent investigations by unattached parties?
Just like Politics, Friends and Family go way too deep and exert undue influence in these "Cases", the threats, direct conflicts of interest and extenuating circumstances come from places you would least expect. 2nd Cousin School Board Members, Uncle Bus Drivers, the 5th generation farmer Daddy that owns a third of the school district or the Football Hero that got him a Teachin Degree and came back home to beat up on some local kids! I could put actual name's and multiple situations with each and every one of those Titles of dishonor. In a small school like three quarters of CNY, half of the student are related, friends and or Neighbors to someone who works in the school.
How do you fix that? The Lawyers are the least of their problem, I never saw one of those ever after I got my ass whooped, all I ever did was look for a safe corner to hide in!
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Post by firstamendment on Jul 28, 2011 9:15:49 GMT -5
Agreed with both Dave and Swimmy on the zero-tolerance concept. It is a one-size-fits-all policy that does not take into account individual case by case circumstances. We've seen zero tolerance policies with regard to drugs in schools lead to the suspension of kids over cough drops. Yes, something as mundane as a cough drop. This was when zero tolerance policies were first being implemented. These zero-tolerance policies are for the most part like these "feel good" laws that keep getting implemented. Leandra's law comes to mind, making it a felony to drive drunk with kids in the car. Noble, but was it necessary? And keep in mind this ONLY applies if the kids are in the car driven by the drunk, not the car a drunk might hit.
Im the case Swimmy points out, with the nerdy kid defending himself against bullies beating on him, what was the alternative? Let them beat him to a pulp as to NOT violate the zero tolerance policy so he wouldn't get suspended? Yeah, ok, and then pray to God they don't put him in the hospital or worse. Sure, sounds great! I don't think so. That kid, like every other member of the human race has the right to defend themselves and he should not be punished for doing just that. He protected himself from being harmed whereas the school failed to do so. I am guessing this is a public school, and thus their policies shouldn't be able to circumvent the US Constitution in regards to the 14th Amendment of Equal protection. I am not a scholar in those regards, but I'd imagine somewhere in the Constitution does also allow for self defense. See, what zero tolerance fails to consider is a little concept called MITIGATING CIRCUMSTANCES. Would this kid have been involved in a fight had he not been provoked and/or defend oneself? Probably not. The issue here is he did not involve himself in a fight, the fight involved itself upon him. Simply punishing everyone in the fight punishs both the perpetrators and the victims likewise and is inherently wrong. It gives schools an easy out from actually having to determine fault.
As far as partially blaming lawyers, that is an iffy subject. They are, after all, there to represent their clients' interests. Yes, there are some attorneys, Gloria Alred comes to mind, who use their client's interests to further their agenda. But if anything, you'll have to blame the court system for ruling the way they do. Lawyers might present the case, but it is the court system who rule on the validity of them.
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Post by dgriffin on Jul 28, 2011 15:41:08 GMT -5
Yes, blame the lawyers who represented clients' interests. Blame the lawyers who the clients paid to represent their silly stuff that many lawyers did not think they would win. Perhaps the judges duped by the lame lawsuits, sure. You betcha! When all else fails, blame the g.d. lawyers. That's what we always did at work! Seriously, we can find lots of cases where the aggrieved student was deserving of legal counsel and we can find lots of cases where a more mature lawyer would have taken the kid and parents aside and said, "Look, the boy lost his temper and acted out. Sure, we might be able to get you some money, depending on what you think is important here. But my legal and personal advice is for the kid to take responsibility for his act and take his punishment." Often good economic advice, too, when the case is defeated and the parents still have to pay the legal fees. I'm not referring here to cases where a child is bullied and the school refuses to do anything. I'm thinking of cases where a student and his family are trying to take advantage of the law even when he is in the wrong.
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Post by Swimmy on Jul 28, 2011 17:21:35 GMT -5
But lawyers gotta eat, pay bills, and have a place to sleep too. So what if a more "mature" lawyer would do that. Which is a nice thought since I have given that advice. But, there will always be A lawyer willing to take the case for a fee whether it be because times are tough or the attorney needs experience or to make a name for oneself.
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Post by Swimmy on Jul 28, 2011 17:23:52 GMT -5
And with the pay cut I'm faced with because we are not bringing in as much money as is being spent, you can rest assured that I have taken a few cases that go against my personal beliefs, but we need the money!
Contrary to popular belief, I am not independently wealthy, neither are most of my colleagues. Whenever a client balks at my hourly rate, I try not to laugh at their ignorance. I see about 1% of my hourly rate as salary. The rest goes toward overhead, e.g. support staff salaries, their benefits, building costs, parking lot maintenance, property taxes (or rent if you don't own your own building), grounds maintenance, utility bills, garbage bags, bulk shredding services, copy machine lease fees, copy machine maintenance, telephone lines, printers, computers, dedicated fax lines, Internet, computer maintenance, security systems, clients who don't pay because they think we're sitting on billions in our basement, file retention services (have to keep your files for a minimum of 7 years, that takes up space, secure space), liability insurance, health insurance, legal malpractice insurance, snow removal services, advertising services, payroll taxes, etc.
If you wish to blame anyone, blame the juries for reaching their verdicts, and blame the appellate judges for upholding or reversing those ridiculous verdicts. Above all, as it has been my experience with people wanting to exploit a law when they're wrong or their children are wrong, blame the democrat who paid the lawyer in the first place!
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Post by dgriffin on Jul 28, 2011 17:40:13 GMT -5
OK, OK, it ain't easy being a young struggling (but quixotic) attorney these days. And then I hear stories where rates are fixed in certain cases, like for getting a guy his legitimate workman's comp award. Nowhere near the standard fees.
But to go back to my first point, in our litigious society, schools are scared. Sometimes that's a good thing in that it forces them to do things right. Other time they do only what they think they can defend and they go overboard in self-protection mode ... voila, Zero Tolerance, which was not invented to tighten up school discipline, but rather school self-protection, IMHO. I suppose that in a direct sense that's not the fault of the legal fraternity, but in a less litigious society things might have been different.
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Post by Swimmy on Jul 28, 2011 17:45:16 GMT -5
There you go with those big words, again! lol I hardly think my driving around in a '98 pos used vehicle that was 8 years old when bought, cutting out my cable and LAN phone bills, not dining out every night, a healthy diet of ramman noodles, wearing suits worn in college, wearing shirts until they become unpresentable, buying at any bargain sales possible, etc. is extravagant, impulsive, unpredictable, or impractical.
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Post by Swimmy on Jul 28, 2011 17:48:12 GMT -5
Worker's comp is different. Good attorneys charge a reasonable fee and do not collect anything unless they obtain an award. One guy who practices almost exclusively in WC law charges a flat rate of 10% on any awards. Most personal injury lawsuits charge 33-1/3%. And for some PI suits, where the damages are less, closer to 50%. So you just have to shop around, as with any service you purchase.
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Post by Swimmy on Jul 28, 2011 17:48:55 GMT -5
I agree, the litigious society we live in is directly responsible for some of the crap we now have to put up with.
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Post by firstamendment on Jul 28, 2011 18:27:59 GMT -5
One third on personal injury suits seems to be the standard.
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