Student gets 1-3 year prison term

[Swimmy]

You make good points. To be fair, I was only offering a devil's advocate side. Though, I do think that an alternative method could be had to educate the kids, maybe not to the level of high school graduate or GED, but something like a tradecraft, e.g. carpenter.

However, I do agree very much that education in America is not as valued today by kids or their parents as it used to. I get so annoyed listening to my mother about some of her students. If I was the teacher, I'd have kicked them out of my class and failed them for the year.

[lucy]

I've been wanting to write about this but needed to clear my mind first and decide how would I feel if I were their parents. The 21 year old and under crowd should go to a military style boot camp, and learn some self respect. These kids don't respect anything, and the reason for that is they don't have any respect for themselves. Them sitting in jail with mommy and daddy giving them money for snacks, radio is no help. Believe me I have seen that with my own eyes. All they do is sit in a cell and sleep, read, talk to other inmates and the list goes on. I'm not saying its a vacation for them but once they are out what are they going to do?
For the criminals that are over the age of 21 I feel that they should re-instate the chain gang. Seriously what else are these convicts doing but waisting our money! They should be doing things in the community. For instance, our dug outs at the town park were built by inmates, and I feel since there are enough inmates to go around that there are a lot of things in this state that could get done by inmates.
What I see a lot on other websites people saying well what kind of home did these kids come from, their parents should've beat them yadayadayada.... I can tell you it doesn't matter what kind of home a child comes from they are going to do what they want to do. For instance my brother and I are two different people that grew up in the same house. We both took different paths in our life, and I hope and pray that his life changes. He has no respect for himself. I can talk to him until I'm blue in the face and nothing will change. I just wished so badly this last time he was in trouble that he would get out and do something with his life. I honestly feel a boot camp type of environment to show discipline, and working hard to get something will give them the self respect that they need. Instead of sitting in jail and learning on how to be a better criminal.

[Disgusted-Daily]

NY State currently has Prisons that are camps. But our recent Governor feels they are not needed or worth having. They were recently on the chopping block to be closed. The Officers union NYSCOBPA rallied in Albany recently and the Governor was convinced to not close them.

They are currently opened today thanks to the hard work from the people in the affected communities right on up to the Politicians.

I agree we do need more Camps for the kids to young to make it to the Big House. But as the saying goes, "We'll leave the light on".

[Swimmy]

I don't get that last part "We'll leave the light on."

I was not aware that in spite of the proved success of these camps, the governor would deem them unnecessary and try to rid them from existence. That should have been borderline political suicide. Why don't I remember this in the news?

[dgriffin]

I took Todd's comment to mean "we'll be waiting at the prisons if you fail the camps." But, really, all of this should be easy to analyze. How well do camp graduates do? The governor's attempt to close them speaks to me of saving money. The officers' protest speaks to me of saving jobs.
But what does the data say?

[Disgusted-Daily]

What I meant was if we don't do a better job with the kids today in parenting or instituting camps they will end up in Prison. The phrase "We'll leave the light on" meant it is inevitable that they will end up there. Just one big revolving door.

The camps not only teach discipline and responsibility but they are taken out in public as work crews and do work for non-profit organizations such as schools, churches, parks, canal, thruway work and much more.

Dave, you asked what the date says. Not sure myself. I don't know if there was one ever published. I am sure allot of the them re-offend or violate their parole when they get out, but while their in the camps it is very productive.

We need to get started some where and as lucy stated a camp for kids just may work instead of a Juvenile Center and/or Prison.

[Swimmy]

Speaking only on what I observed in the Lansing State Journal when I was in law school and with no study to cite to, it appeared that the camp was truly effective. Many of the students returned to "normal" life and never had a problem again. Some were inspired to go into law enforcement. Others opted for the armed services. But aside from maybe one or two just about everyone who entered the school came out a better and changed person.

[dgriffin]

Thanks, todd. Here's an interesting document on the Shock Facilities:
www.docs.state.ny.us/Research/Reports/Shock_2007_Executive_Summary.pdf
It never directly addresses recidivism, but instead speaks of "success on parole supervision," which I suppose you could take as the same, but I wonder why they don't specifically speak of how many commit crimes afterward. The report claims a number of successes of the program, including those for the inmates and society ... education, reading skills, volunteer work ... and for the state ... less time and expense during incarceration. But the statistics would of course be affected by whatever the selection criteria is for the program.

Swimmy, I've also heard what you have.

[Swimmy]

Interesting report, thank you for sharing it.